Leto
Grizzled Warrior
I'd love to talk but I'm no good in groups :)
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Post by Leto on May 17, 2017 22:48:18 GMT
Most of my Hawkes have been celibate because it's Varric or bust for me and Isabella was so far my only alternative, but I wanna go Fenris the next time I play. I have my ideological disagreements with him about some stuff (tranquility), but I think throwing a mage Hawke at him will just make for a very interesting dynamic. Plus, I always liked him as a character. I think I'll start out with the friendship romance as well, although I imagine his rivalry path is interesting, too. Good thing companions don't really react to gameplay, though, because I love blood magic in DA2 and spec it pretty much every time I play a mage. Oops... I'm sorry, Fenris. I admit to being totally biased, but I think his romance arc is definitely worth a run or two (or six). His approval points do take some juggling with a pro-mage playthrough. I generally tend to swap teammates around so I can max his approval early in act 2 so I don't have to think about it any more. The first playthrough where my Hawke was in a relationship with him by the near end of act 3 he was only just enough into the approval to keep the relationship going. It definitely made for an interesting, if more fraught one. |
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Post by jadeprince on May 17, 2017 23:11:17 GMT
Most of my Hawkes have been celibate because it's Varric or bust for me and Isabella was so far my only alternative, but I wanna go Fenris the next time I play. I have my ideological disagreements with him about some stuff (tranquility), but I think throwing a mage Hawke at him will just make for a very interesting dynamic. Plus, I always liked him as a character. I think I'll start out with the friendship romance as well, although I imagine his rivalry path is interesting, too. Good thing companions don't really react to gameplay, though, because I love blood magic in DA2 and spec it pretty much every time I play a mage. Oops... I'm sorry, Fenris. I always friendmance Fenris with a pro-mage mage, and I looove it. There's enough approval points available that even if he disapproves of some of the things you say, it's still possible to be friends and romance him.  I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous. |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
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Post by Catilina on May 17, 2017 23:22:10 GMT
Most of my Hawkes have been celibate because it's Varric or bust for me and Isabella was so far my only alternative, but I wanna go Fenris the next time I play. I have my ideological disagreements with him about some stuff (tranquility), but I think throwing a mage Hawke at him will just make for a very interesting dynamic. Plus, I always liked him as a character. I think I'll start out with the friendship romance as well, although I imagine his rivalry path is interesting, too. Good thing companions don't really react to gameplay, though, because I love blood magic in DA2 and spec it pretty much every time I play a mage. Oops... I'm sorry, Fenris. I admit to being totally biased, but I think his romance arc is definitely worth a run or two (or six). His approval points do take some juggling with a pro-mage playthrough. I generally tend to swap teammates around so I can max his approval early in act 2 so I don't have to think about it any more. The first playthrough where my Hawke was in a relationship with him by the near end of act 3 he was only just enough into the approval to keep the relationship going. It definitely made for an interesting, if more fraught one. The critical point is just the Act 1 even rivalry and friendship. And Hadriana in rivalry (100000 inevitable friendship points). The quest order and the Book of Shartan timing count a lot. I did a "without compromise" friendship run as hard-line pro-mage mage Hawke, and was much easier than I expected. I took him everywhere and doesn't use wiki, only my memory. |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
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Post by Catilina on May 17, 2017 23:35:02 GMT
Most of my Hawkes have been celibate because it's Varric or bust for me and Isabella was so far my only alternative, but I wanna go Fenris the next time I play. I have my ideological disagreements with him about some stuff (tranquility), but I think throwing a mage Hawke at him will just make for a very interesting dynamic. Plus, I always liked him as a character. I think I'll start out with the friendship romance as well, although I imagine his rivalry path is interesting, too. Good thing companions don't really react to gameplay, though, because I love blood magic in DA2 and spec it pretty much every time I play a mage. Oops... I'm sorry, Fenris. I always friendmance Fenris with a pro-mage mage, and I looove it. There's enough approval points available that even if he disapproves of some of the things you say, it's still possible to be friends and romance him. I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous.He knows that well. Even that there are Magisters, who be real noble persons, who can resist the temptation (Act 1, first visit at Gallows). He's not that close-minded. |
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Post by jadeprince on May 18, 2017 0:05:10 GMT
I always friendmance Fenris with a pro-mage mage, and I looove it. There's enough approval points available that even if he disapproves of some of the things you say, it's still possible to be friends and romance him. I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous.He knows that well. Even that there are Magisters, who be real noble persons, who can resist the temptation (Act 1, first visit at Gallows). He's not that close-minded. I'm not disagreeing with you or even saying that he doesn't know that on an intellectual level. I just like to think that romancing Fenris with a mage ultimately helps him to be able to react to magic with something other than immediate distrust. It's cool if you see it different though. I was just gushing.  |
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Post by toomanyclouds on May 18, 2017 5:06:10 GMT
I admit to being totally biased, but I think his romance arc is definitely worth a run or two (or six). His approval points do take some juggling with a pro-mage playthrough. I generally tend to swap teammates around so I can max his approval early in act 2 so I don't have to think about it any more. The first playthrough where my Hawke was in a relationship with him by the near end of act 3 he was only just enough into the approval to keep the relationship going. It definitely made for an interesting, if more fraught one. Oh yeah, I've gotten really good at juggling approval points because on my first playthrough, I actually had to kill Fenris.  I didn't know that could happen! Isabella tends to be the hardest for me for some reason, probably because I haven't really understood her "thing" yet that I can exploit aside from healthy greed, lol. I always friendmance Fenris with a pro-mage mage, and I looove it. There's enough approval points available that even if he disapproves of some of the things you say, it's still possible to be friends and romance him. I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous. Yeah, I have to admit that's the kind of internal narrative I'm hoping for as well.  It just feels like a romance that could really take the fear out of a lot of life for Fenris and because of the time span of DA2, it would actually feel quite organic that Fenris is slowly working through his prejudice and sees not all mages are like Tevinter magisters. |
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Post by Lee on May 19, 2017 8:41:49 GMT
Fenris (that is all) |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
Wanted Apostate
Posts: 827
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Post by Catilina on May 19, 2017 10:40:03 GMT
I admit to being totally biased, but I think his romance arc is definitely worth a run or two (or six). His approval points do take some juggling with a pro-mage playthrough. I generally tend to swap teammates around so I can max his approval early in act 2 so I don't have to think about it any more. The first playthrough where my Hawke was in a relationship with him by the near end of act 3 he was only just enough into the approval to keep the relationship going. It definitely made for an interesting, if more fraught one. Oh yeah, I've gotten really good at juggling approval points because on my first playthrough, I actually had to kill Fenris. I didn't know that could happen! Isabella tends to be the hardest for me for some reason, probably because I haven't really understood her "thing" yet that I can exploit aside from healthy greed, lol. I always friendmance Fenris with a pro-mage mage, and I looove it. There's enough approval points available that even if he disapproves of some of the things you say, it's still possible to be friends and romance him. I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous.Yeah, I have to admit that's the kind of internal narrative I'm hoping for as well. It just feels like a romance that could really take the fear out of a lot of life for Fenris and because of the time span of DA2, it would actually feel quite organic that Fenris is slowly working through his prejudice and sees not all mages are like Tevinter magisters.Fenris much smarter to having "prejudices". He has fear, no more. If he can forget this for a moment, he's able to think objectively. He's very practical and strong. One of my favorite scene with him, when I discovered I fell in love again. (It was recent because I generally prevent Justice to kill Ella, just as Fenris to kill Varania.)    It shows, that he's much more open-minded, that many people think about him. This scene takes place in the Act1, when Fenris only three years ago escaped. plus: Sebastian: It's our duty to tell the templars. Fenris: Then why haven't you done it? Sebastian: I guess I was hoping they'd come to it on their own. Fenris: And then you wouldn't have to betray Hawke's friends, right? Sebastian: That's not reason enough to allow a maleficar to walk free. (If Anders is in the party)Anders: You think the templars don't know I'm here? They just haven't caught me yet. (If Merrill is in the party)Merrill: Are you talking about me? Sebastian: Which of us should do it? Shall we draw lots? Fenris: Uh-uh. You want to turn them in, you work it out with Hawke. But true, there are moments, when he can't leave his own shadows (and this is understandable). |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 16:43:47 GMT
Catilina I agree with you so much. Fenris isn't prejudiced. He isn't a mage-hater. He's an abuse victim. He's a good person who was abused his entire life (via slavery) and then most recently through Danarius. We know there was incredible pain during the ritual; we know he suffered beyond what we can imagine. We know there was extreme humiliation with the way he had to serve Danarius. We know there was sexual assualt. And the fact that he can have that conversation with Anders as early as Act 1 shows that he doesn't hate the person, miraculously; he hates magic. Magic HURT him. He's terrified of it. Uncontrolled magic in the hands of the weak-minded and the power-hungry are his greatest fear. Anders, who has also suffered greatly, is unable to see this; not surprisingly, he sees only a mage-hater, and he reacts accordingly. They were never going to be friends, which is rather sad, because without stupid Justice fucking things up I think Anders would have liked Fenris and would have won him over.
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
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Post by Catilina on May 19, 2017 20:52:23 GMT
Catilina I agree with you so much. Fenris isn't prejudiced. He isn't a mage-hater. He's an abuse victim. He's a good person who was abused his entire life (via slavery) and then most recently through Danarius. We know there was incredible pain during the ritual; we know he suffered beyond what we can imagine. We know there was extreme humiliation with the way he had to serve Danarius. We know there was sexual assualt. And the fact that he can have that conversation with Anders as early as Act 1 shows that he doesn't hate the person, miraculously; he hates magic. Magic HURT him. He's terrified of it. Uncontrolled magic in the hands of the weak-minded and the power-hungry are his greatest fear. Anders, who has also suffered greatly, is unable to see this; not surprisingly, he sees only a mage-hater, and he reacts accordingly. They were never going to be friends, which is rather sad, because without stupid Justice fucking things up I think Anders would have liked Fenris and would have won him over. There are some reasons, why it is so difficult to become friends – at least in Kirkwall in these times. The main reason is their past. The second is Kirkwall. The third is their temper and misunderstanding (rooted by their past) But not Justice. (I know, probably this isn't so popular opinion.) Yes, his greatest fear is uncontrolled magic, weak mind, and power-hunger: so the temptation mixed with weak mind. He perhaps hates the magic, but he wants to leave this hatred because he wants to live. I'm sure, that he knows, that the magic just a tool, but at the moment he needs some target to his hatred. But magic is just as the weather: how he can blame the rain? This just exists in the world. (Probably I can't words well, but I think, he knows, that meaningless to "hate" something, what just exist.) He wants to be free from this meaningless hatred: " It's poison, yet I continue to swallow it." (Act3, after Alone, rivalry.) He even didn't want to kill Hadriana. Not because he felt sorry for Hadriana, rather because of himself. He feels the anger's uncontrollable power. |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 0:14:46 GMT
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Post by Lee on May 21, 2017 6:23:18 GMT
I simply must get back to my da2 run tomorrow night (it's pretty late to start playing now...but you never know). I am going to meet Fenris next.  |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
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Posts: 827
Likes: 3,282
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 12:38:45 GMT
I simply must get back to my da2 run tomorrow night (it's pretty late to start playing now...but you never know). I am going to meet Fenris next.  source |
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Post by Lee on May 21, 2017 17:21:33 GMT
I simply must get back to my da2 run tomorrow night (it's pretty late to start playing now...but you never know). I am going to meet Fenris next. I talked myself into playing some last night. I flirted with that boy something fierce. I also did one out of character speech option just to shameless get friend points with him. I already had Bethany friend maxed so I said I knew mages could be dangerous! Don't judge me too harshly fellow Pro Mage friends! I'm weak for Fenris friend points! |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
Wanted Apostate
Posts: 827
Likes: 3,282
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 17:33:22 GMT
I talked myself into playing some last night. I flirted with that boy something fierce. I also did one out of character speech option just to shameless get friend points with him. I already had Bethany friend maxed so I said I knew mages could be dangerous! Don't judge me too harshly fellow Pro Mage friends! I'm weak for Fenris friend points! It's easy to befriend with him without compromise about the mage issues, You don't need to betray Bethany, just because she already loves you! Of course, if your Hawke fears from the mages (Malcolm or Bethany accidentally ignited the curtain, and that burned into his retina?), you can send back Ella to the Circle, where they wanted to rape her...  Ok, now seriously, it only depend your Hawke's feeling. And if you want to romance him with a character, who feel same way than he about magic. |
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Post by Lee on May 21, 2017 17:36:42 GMT
I talked myself into playing some last night. I flirted with that boy something fierce. I also did one out of character speech option just to shameless get friend points with him. I already had Bethany friend maxed so I said I knew mages could be dangerous! Don't judge me too harshly fellow Pro Mage friends! I'm weak for Fenris friend points! It's easy to befriend with him without compromise about the mage issues, You don't need to betray Bethany, just because she already loves you! Of course, if your Hawke fears from the mages (Malcolm or Bethany accidentally ignited the curtain, and that burned into his retina?), you can returns back Ella to the Circle, where they wanted to rape her... Ok, now seriously, it only depend your Hawke's feeling. And if you want to romance him with a character, who feel same way than he about magic. I'm still going to be pro-mage and make all the major choices that way. I just may play along with some of Fenris bs since I decided to friend max him. I'm not sure what I'll say when I take him to the circle though. I remember you have to vocalize a stance on mage freedom to gain or lose friend points. Why game must you put me on the spot with my husband!!!???? |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
Wanted Apostate
Posts: 827
Likes: 3,282
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 17:59:39 GMT
It's easy to befriend with him without compromise about the mage issues, You don't need to betray Bethany, just because she already loves you! Of course, if your Hawke fears from the mages (Malcolm or Bethany accidentally ignited the curtain, and that burned into his retina?), you can returns back Ella to the Circle, where they wanted to rape her... Ok, now seriously, it only depend your Hawke's feeling. And if you want to romance him with a character, who feel same way than he about magic. I'm still going to be pro-mage and make all the major choices that way. I just may play along with some of Fenris bs since I decided to friend max him. I'm not sure what I'll say when I take him to the circle though. I remember you have to vocalize a stance on mage freedom to gain or lose friend points. Why game must you put me on the spot with my husband!!!???? I almost always was in 100% friendship (or rivalry) with him, regardless, in romance or not (as I remember, only once was ~80%, in first game – Anders love), and never was forced to take decisions against the mages. In fact, I found rivalry harder, even with pro-mage. The secret that you don't need to fear to take him everywhere, at Ella quest you lose only 5 friendship, because he appreciates, if Hawke doesn't let Justice to kill Ella. He gives friendship points here. You can absolutely honest with him, he mostly likes the humanity (except in Trask's case, that's a bullshit). UPDATE: He even appreciates, if Hawke refuse the sloth demon in the fade, OR accept it's offer first, "kills" Justice, and after the sloth demon (Interesting dialogue with Anders after this) The rivalry or friendship only depend on my Hawke's temper, for example, my warrior (Anders romance) finished at 100% friendship with him (he was cute, told that he hope, that we will fight together in the future, so: seems he joined to us to help to free mages? ), but my mages was equal rivalry/friendship with him. |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2017 18:40:42 GMT
It's easy to befriend with him without compromise about the mage issues, You don't need to betray Bethany, just because she already loves you! Of course, if your Hawke fears from the mages (Malcolm or Bethany accidentally ignited the curtain, and that burned into his retina?), you can returns back Ella to the Circle, where they wanted to rape her... Ok, now seriously, it only depend your Hawke's feeling. And if you want to romance him with a character, who feel same way than he about magic. I'm still going to be pro-mage and make all the major choices that way. I just may play along with some of Fenris bs since I decided to friend max him. I'm not sure what I'll say when I take him to the circle though. I remember you have to vocalize a stance on mage freedom to gain or lose friend points. Why game must you put me on the spot with my husband!!!???? The "middle" responses only earns +5 rivalry, whereas the super pro-mage response is +10. I go with the middle usually. |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2017 18:42:05 GMT
Also, an easy way to earn +10 friendship is take him with you when trying to find Feynriel (or however you spell his name). You'll encounter the slaver, and you have the option to let Fenris torture him, which you can imagine Fenris just loves  But don't take him with you to the Wounded Coast when you actually find the kid, unless you plan to send Feynriel back to the Circle. Do take Isabela, Merrill, or Anders if you plan to free him. |
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Catilina
The Beastmaster
Wanted Apostate
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 18:47:06 GMT
I'm still going to be pro-mage and make all the major choices that way. I just may play along with some of Fenris bs since I decided to friend max him. I'm not sure what I'll say when I take him to the circle though. I remember you have to vocalize a stance on mage freedom to gain or lose friend points. Why game must you put me on the spot with my husband!!!???? The "middle" responses only earns +5 rivalry, whereas the super pro-mage response is +10. I go with the middle usually. I mostly go with the super-pro-mage response, if I play as radical pro-mage, regardless, that I want to build friendship or rivalry. It's is possible. Only slow down the process, but at Danarius, Hawke already on 100%, and can prevent him to kill Varania, without rivalry gained... (For example Merrill's quest can help, if Hawke doesn't kill her clan, Fenris's happy. So, the quest order can be important, not the answers. |
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I love feeling like I'm slowly, surely changing his mind about magic and showing him that not all mages are cruel and dangerous.
I didn't know that could happen! Isabella tends to be the hardest for me for some reason, probably because I haven't really understood her "thing" yet that I can exploit aside from healthy greed, lol.
It just feels like a romance that could really take the fear out of a lot of life for Fenris and because of the time span of DA2, it would actually feel quite organic that Fenris is slowly working through his prejudice and sees not all mages are like Tevinter magisters.
