|
|
Post by gimolas on May 20, 2019 5:51:17 GMT
What a steaming pile of  that episode was lmao. I'm not disappointed because that's what I was expecting and it's what I got, but still... Vy I think Breaking Bad is the only show I've ever watched that had a well-executed ending, but you already said that, lol. It seems like most tv shows eventually turn into a hot mess. I suspect that GOT's problem was that it outpaced the book content, so they had to rely on the show writers. The dialogue this season has been worse than usual. |
|
|
|
Post by Davrin's boobs on May 20, 2019 5:58:26 GMT
so just read that they turned the unsullied . into the bad guys hunting for Jon??? fucking former POC slaves ???
edit. i think they meant only grey worm, I have seen people talking crap about my son.  Black Sails has excellent POC representation btw. anyways fuck this show! |
|
|
|
Post by Vy on May 20, 2019 6:07:08 GMT
Not to get too off-topic, but what would the rest of you say are some heavily-serialized TV shows that actually managed to have really strong endings? The main ones that come to mind for me are Babylon 5 and Breaking Bad.
not to be a fanboy but Buffy has the best ending ever and it is the best show ever. If you want something akin to GoT, Spartacus has a good ending with cool gay rep unlike GoT, then again it's heavy based on real life Spartacus so, you have been warned lol the last show I have seen with a cool ending was Black Sails, a show with pirates and cool lgbtq rep too and with great female characters. Both are lgbtq friendly. I dont know if I'm gonna buy the books if this is the ending GRRM has in mind though, I cant buy Dany being the mad queen, genetics as narrative force is one of the most LAMEST use of writing ... That's what libraries are for, I guess. I think that if Dany does go mad queen in the books, it's much more likely that it'll have the buildup that that sort of arc warrants. Especially since (as a friend who has read the books as explained to me) the circumstances when she arrives in Westeros are going to be very different from how they were in the show, and the potential "cracks" in Dany's mental state are made clearer earlier on. This is the sort of character shift that needs at least a season to develop, not three episodes.
In that case, I wouldn't necessarily say it's necessarily a case of "genetics as narrative force" as much as it is the sheer entitlement that comes with being a monarch colliding with severe extenuating circumstances.
|
|
|
|
Post by Davrin's boobs on May 20, 2019 6:19:57 GMT
That's what libraries are for, I guess. I think that if Dany does go mad queen in the books, it's much more likely that it'll have the buildup that that sort of arc warrants. Especially since (as a friend who has read the books as explained to me) the circumstances when she arrives in Westeros are going to be very different from how they were in the show, and the potential "cracks" in Dany's mental state are made clearer earlier on. This is the sort of character shift that needs at least a season to develop, not three episodes.
In that case, I wouldn't necessarily say it's necessarily a case of "genetics as narrative force" as much as it is the sheer entitlement that comes with being a monarch colliding with severe extenuating circumstances.
the whole "flip a coin", "mad as her father" yada yada, it's been clear that they are pointing out to genetics, then again this whole Darth Daenerys, no matter how well is written in the books from a mental health point of view is just plain bullshit. Powerful female representation has been just robbed and violated, it's just a pity, what we could have had where women in position of power focusing not in their differences but her similar experiences (Sansa and Daenerys) to the trash. Damn I just read that they made some kind of Arya vs Yara verbal confrontation, making the only openly lgbtq character seem bad because she supports the "mad queen" lol ... I cant accept this kind of narrative for the books I just cannot, then again I need to remind myself the show and the books are written by straight men. The books still has chance to pass through history as one of the most important example of female empowerment but tbh I'm not holding my breath on that. And I will be probably 60 when an undead GRRM release the last book so  |
|
|
|
Post by Lee on May 20, 2019 7:07:16 GMT
I had a feeling I should stop watching this show when I did. I honestly don't remember what season I watched last was (number wise) I remember that the red wedding happened. I think that's what it was called. The mountain killed the hot bisexual guy..after that I was like..."that's enough of that show, maybe I'll watch it if it's ever on netflix, but hbo subscription isn't worth it for this." Hearing it got worse is not shocking. Most shows do. I mean True Blood was so amazingly good almost every season-but the very last one. What a shit show that was. The ending- Where Bill killed himself and declared that Sookie had to marry a human and have a baby so she could be happy...cause breeding is the only way a woman can truly be happy. ugh, so annoying. She said from episode one or so on that she didn't date humans cause she couldn't deal with reading their minds all the time. that was quite a ramble. I might still have some unresolved anger there.  |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 20, 2019 18:09:06 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by Vy on May 20, 2019 21:56:19 GMT
That's what libraries are for, I guess. I think that if Dany does go mad queen in the books, it's much more likely that it'll have the buildup that that sort of arc warrants. Especially since (as a friend who has read the books as explained to me) the circumstances when she arrives in Westeros are going to be very different from how they were in the show, and the potential "cracks" in Dany's mental state are made clearer earlier on. This is the sort of character shift that needs at least a season to develop, not three episodes.
In that case, I wouldn't necessarily say it's necessarily a case of "genetics as narrative force" as much as it is the sheer entitlement that comes with being a monarch colliding with severe extenuating circumstances.
the whole "flip a coin", "mad as her father" yada yada, it's been clear that they are pointing out to genetics, then again this whole Darth Daenerys, no matter how well is written in the books from a mental health point of view is just plain bullshit. Powerful female representation has been just robbed and violated, it's just a pity, what we could have had where women in position of power focusing not in their differences but her similar experiences (Sansa and Daenerys) to the trash. Damn I just read that they made some kind of Arya vs Yara verbal confrontation, making the only openly lgbtq character seem bad because she supports the "mad queen" lol ... I cant accept this kind of narrative for the books I just cannot, then again I need to remind myself the show and the books are written by straight men. The books still has chance to pass through history as one of the most important example of female empowerment but tbh I'm not holding my breath on that. And I will be probably 60 when an undead GRRM release the last book so Is it genetics, or is it being raised to believe that you are entitled to control an entire continent and everyone in it? In the show I think they lean way too heavily on the former, but I think the latter is a much more understandable reason for a monarch to become volatile and is more likely to be where the books go if Daenerys does turn into a darker character.
I think the broader problem is that Dany is the only female character in the main cast who's proactive, fundamentally good, and who has a major impact on the broader story, so when the writers turned her evil it stung a lot more. I'm still really annoyed about how they didn't go with a "war of the five queens" plotline in Season 7 to finish off Cersei, leaving all of Season 8 for the long night, dealing with the white walkers, and the falling action.
As an aside, I'm also disappointed that Jon didn't become more ruthless after he came back from the dead, since in the books most characters who come back from the dead tend to be harsher and more single-minded. I thought they were going to go in that direction when he executed Olly, but then a few episodes passed and there was barely any sign that him dying changed him at all. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 0:15:31 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by vertigomez on May 21, 2019 1:23:20 GMT
Okay there's so much shit I could talk about but I will voice my appreciation for that epic shot with Dany framed by Drogon's wings That and da queen in da norf! were really the only things I can give it ehh. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 2:26:58 GMT
from here Guess I'm glad that Sansa is Queen of the North, but did killing the Night King just stop the upcoming long Winter? from here  See this
|
|
|
|
Post by mediocreogre on May 21, 2019 3:56:44 GMT
I got a kick out of it, in a “oh my god i can’t believe it is this phoned in” sort of way. Even if all the plot points are your cup of tea, there were sloppy edits, rushed scenes, and confused performances this whole season but especially this episode.
I had fun with it though and the memes are worth it. I feel like if it was a true GoT ending or less rough I would have missed out on some much needed levity and laughing at chaos. Scratched an itch I didn’t know I had, but I feel bad for some people who were disappointed or let down. Sucks.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 15:01:20 GMT
lol...  |
|
|
|
Post by yourfunnyuncle on May 21, 2019 17:54:02 GMT
I really do think that there's a good story in there, it was just far too rushed in terms of time and easily-fixable nit-picks, as well as focusing on the wrong elements. The coffee cup episode was a metaphor for the whole season. I would've really enjoyed a better-executed version of what we saw. As it was the whole season has felt rushed and slipshod. I think the central thesis of it all is broadly that power corrupts, and specifically that hereditary absolute monarchy is complete cancer. In Sansa and Dany, we have two initially idealistic young women twisted in different ways by its machinations. Sansa found herself a near-powerless in other people's machinations for power, as she saw her father killed, her engagement turned into a nightmare, only to be "rescued" by another Machiavellian plotter to be a pawn in his games.
In Dany, we've seen a woman struggling to overcome others' machinations, and forced to make brutal decisions in order to stay on what she perceives to be her rightful path to power. What we saw all-too-briefly in this season was the love of her life betray her trust, at least in her eyes, leading her supposed allies and advisors to plot against her, while her dearest friends and protectors died. She saw the people of Westeros, who she had been promised would flock to her banners, reluctant to rise up against the despotic Cersei. These things, properly played out, should have been enough to see her decide, with her inner circle collapsing around her, that the best course of action would be to wipe out King's Landing and put an end to the whole nest of vipers without them needing to throw in the "toss a coin to see if you get a crazy Targaryen" elements, or at least to have them downplayed or shown to be wrong.
I suspect that, should GRRM ever manage to write them, this is how we may see things play out in the books. What I don't think is that it was every going to have a fully "happy" ending.
All that said, I don't think you can say that the ending was anti-feminist and not progressive. You have:
- A queen in the North
- A woman in charge of the Iron Islands
- A woman in charge of the Kingsguard
- A female-led voyage of discovery underway
- A wheelchair-bound non-warrior king with a little person as his hand
- The resurrected male warrior "hero" with the "best claim to the throne" essentially exiled
Perhaps most crucially, you have the end of hereditary monarchy, which is the first step along the road to fairer system of government. Sure, they laughed at Sam's suggestion of some form of democracy, but that doesn't tend to happen overnight without a bloody revolution. |
|
|
|
Post by Davrin's boobs on May 21, 2019 18:39:30 GMT
The ending is just continuing the status quo of patriarchy, period. Making the most powerful female character bad to make the male option seem more fit to throne is just bullshit. This show has been like the typical straight man with a "feminist ally" facade just to get into women's bed. Totally disgusting.
A bunch -majority- of men deciding who should sit on the throne, that ends up being a man. Shook. When you have Sansa right there. She may be queen in the north but then again, that's just a candy to shut people up but I'm not buying their bullshit.
Sorority has been NON-EXISTENT this season, women in position of power facing each other like crazy hags. Feminist character arcs to the garbage because shock value, Brienne's character reduced to an unrequited love for a man, dialogue lines from Sansa saying that her being raped made her strong is problematic as fuck, Cersei one of the most important player in the game of thrones reduced to being weak crying in Jaime's arms, Yara's only line just to face Arya, Daenerys... well.
This is my last post about this show, not gonna waste my time discussing when thinking about what Dumb and Dumber did because just boils my blood. |
|
|
|
Post by mediocreogre on May 21, 2019 18:40:26 GMT
I mean it is not that there were no women who “won” it’s that the focus of the story is the actions of men on women, besides two women who coincidently are the baddies whose actions caused basically all the traumas of the show and whose deaths serve to return power to men. Also female characters “falling into” positions of power because the deaths of all other male characters is less feminist and structurally a corallary of our real world patriarchies. And even the creation of the night king by a female looking child of the forest...
There’s also a whole thing about Jon Snow and his ability to whine and free himself from responsibility that is quintessentially patriarchal in a world where women have no agency, are punished when they do, and have to win the familial lottery to get power. So a certain female character fleeing responsibility and seeking personal fulfillment is truly the only feminist thing I saw.
And realism is a dumb argument. The books are fantasy and have many examples of women in charge, even in Westeros. So these are show problems.
|
|
|
|
Post by Davrin's boobs on May 21, 2019 20:01:53 GMT
this gotta be posted
|
|
|
|
Post by Vy on May 21, 2019 22:34:21 GMT
As an aside from the Daenerys discussion, was anybody else disappointed that Cleganebowl didn't actually amount to anything beyond Sandor having a chance to get back at his brother before he died? Part of the reason I was excited about the original theory (where Sandor would face Gregor in Cersei's trial by combat in Season 6) was because it would give that character conflict a broader impact. In the scene we got, Gregor and Cersei and Qyburn were going to be dead by the end of the day anyway.
|
|
|
|
Post by Davrin's boobs on May 24, 2019 14:35:21 GMT
This👏👏👏👏 also WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK edit. Game of Thrones: How much do women speak in the show? wow so feminist /irony.... Pretty much the only good thing this show had were its white and straight female characters, and they did dirty to them in season finale which puts this show in the garbage of male fantasy fiction... Blergh. Also fuck me because I said I wouldnt waste more time with this crap... 
|
|
|
|
Post by gimolas on May 24, 2019 20:03:56 GMT
As an aside from the Daenerys discussion, was anybody else disappointed that Cleganebowl didn't actually amount to anything beyond Sandor having a chance to get back at his brother before he died? Part of the reason I was excited about the original theory (where Sandor would face Gregor in Cersei's trial by combat in Season 6) was because it would give that character conflict a broader impact. In the scene we got, Gregor and Cersei and Qyburn were going to be dead by the end of the day anyway.
I thought Cleganebowl was okay, but I was never that excited for it because there was never a reason for it besides just that the Hound wanted to fight real bad? Like, Gregor was a zombie and even before that I was never given the sense that he was anywhere near as invested in this fight as Sandor, if at all, so it didn't make sense to me that this is what made him break through the mind control or whatever it is. lol |
|
|
|
Post by nocte on Sept 26, 2019 15:56:05 GMT
I know I'm like a million years late to bitch about the GoT finale, but I'm here now lmao, so.. I agree with most people here that the sudden about face with Dany was fucking stupid. I think it read like an alt-right wet dream that the female leader of a rebel group of mostly PoC ex-slaves would go powermad to the extreme and have to be put down by a benevolent white man of a noble lineage.
There's something that I wonder since reading the books more recently, though. For people that have read them, do you think Dany's story got fucked because Aegon doesn't exist in the TV show? Not Jon also being Aegon 2, but Jon's half brother that did not survive in the TV show? I read those chapters under the point of view of the knight that raised him and he keeps on rambling about the bells during the Battle of the Bells that was this huge, defining moment for him and I'm like.. this has to be relevant to the bells at the end of the story. This is literally the only character in this world traumatized by bells and it has to mean something, right. lol
So, basically, I wonder if the "mad Targaryen" plot in the books is actually Aegon after his guardian dies or from him influence. It's possible the books don't even plan to have Dany survive until the end and we get Egg 1 vs Egg 2 (Jon) instead of Jon vs Dany. I think that would still suck, because I find Dany and her people to be the most compelling, but it would still be less fucking stupid than this. |
|
that episode was lmao. I'm not disappointed because that's what I was expecting and it's what I got, but still... 
